Discussion in 'N55' started by doublespaces, Jan 18, 2017.
Here are the specs:
Here is a slightly related comment by Pure about N55 Engines:
"We have recently learned some things about the N55 motor. The biggest one that hasn't seemed to make it to the forums yet, is that they appear to be much weaker internally than an N54. I know of 4x N55 motors now, all single turbo cars making 600-650whp, that bent or broke rods. There's only a handful of N55 ST cars around, so that may be a majority of them with broken motors, lol. I'm sure a motor would last for a while with a conservative tune, great fuel, and no mistakes. But unless you want to explore new territory with a built motor, single turbo, etc., the N55 is best with 450-550whp and a simple setup, like PURE Stg2.
The stock N55 engine seems to eventually break at the 600+whp level."
part of the issue I see is everyone is trying make crazy amounts of torque super low in the rpms. Very low RPMS and gobs of torque spells disaster for any stock engine.
These engines would do better with a linear more relaxed build up of torque
I say this all the time, but people seem to shrug off basic physics lol
This kit looks pretty nice though. Depending on how complete it is, It could really be a contender!
speaking of which; they should make a kit for the n54..
nvm send all da torkz 2 da wheels
I wouldn't take Pure's comments seriously. The rod design on the N55 is better than the N54, on paper. They look identical in design and material with the main difference being:
If N55's are bending rods at 600whp+ it's probably because of tuning. No one running that much whp on an N55 (E-series) has a proper tune YET. These guys are almost all relying on the JB4 and outdated COBB backend flashes. The JB4's ability to send/receive data reliably enough to support these power levels without hiccups is questionable... Personally, I could never trust my motor to JB4 biasing and meth/PI control. MHD, and the expanded access to DME tables, will help close some of the tuning gaps on the N55 platform.
You also have to consider that Pure's comments are coming at a time when N55 turbo kits are starting to hit the market that outshine and undercut their own PS2 offering...
Hey guys, thanks for the post! I just got an email from Tyler asking to come here and answer questions on the kit, so I'll keep checking in and answer, if folks have more questions/comments.
To kick it off though, some background, I wanted to design a kit that would give me and others the option of a 600+whp daily driver with stock-like driveability and part quality/reliability (using quality parts - BW EFR turbo, cast manifold, SS downpipe, etc)... for less than $5k.
As for the comments above on N55's bending rods above 600hp, I would have to agree with what was already said here, in that tuning plays a laaarge part of how any of these games plays out. Manufacturers design parts to have certain design margin (component stresses during worst-case combustion events) in place to hit their reliability targets with a distribution across thousands of vehicles. I know this, as I've been an engineer on the oem side of things for nearly 20 years... When turning up the knob to 2x the stock vehicle hp, we are using some of that margin. Now, when tunes are not quite dialed, and misfires and pre-ignition happen, the stresses in the rods/piston/crank can double, relative to a normal combustion event, so now rather than 2x the stress, we are at 4x the stress of a stock setup. When that happens, I'm not surprised if any engine, be it N54, N55, a smallblock Chevy or Ford, etc would see something damaged in the rotating assembly.
I've been daily driving my test mule (2014 335i) for this kit for about a year without issues. I would be interested in seeing and hearing about these other N55's that have had issues though. Does anyone have any background on them so we can help the N55 community?
Thanks for joining and taking the time to present your product to us. In case I missed it, how are you tuning this thing?
pretty much. It all boils down to tuning. everyone knows that Large increase in torque at low RPM's is not the best for any engine, but people still do it. Proper tune and these engines will be fine IMO
Jeff, thanks for stopping in. The setup you are advertising looks very promising. have you done any installs or testing on any E-series? Random question, what did you use for tuning on the car in the video?
I too, would like to know what tuning the cars with blown engines was using. Was it just a JB4? and JB4 alone without any real timing or fuel control? or were there flashed? If just a JB4, i can see things going Awry due to the way it works once you start getting into higher and higher power levels.
Is your test car a Manual or Auto? i may have missed it.
I'm actually about to get back on the dyno with a Big turbo N55 tomorrow if this chip update gets delivered today. Cars running a PTE 6266 turbo with all the supporting mods. Put down 650whp already, going to try for 700whp.
Looking forward to more information and etc. Let me know if you're interested in E-series testing.
Most of the hearsay about the N55 not being able to make power without breaking comes mainly from the N54 guys talking smack. you know that battle for superiority thing?
But only have heard of a handful of failures on N55. but regardless, until the envelope is pushed, the limit wont be found.
Haha yeah I thought that was funny that Pure declared the N55 hp limit being right at the edge of what they claim their product can do... lets see the data...
I'm running a Bootmod3 flash, and using the JB4 as basically a boost controller over the flash. Auto trans (zf8). For fuel I have our own port inj kit, controlled by AIC6. I would agree with Twisted on that, if someone is trying to go for big power on a piggyback, that is risky for sure - not only for the engine, but on auto trans - line pressure not proportional to torque.
I haven't setup our kit on an E series yet, but it is in the plans. Looking for a good test mule candidate.
Twisted - good luck on the dyno, if you can hit 700 that would be awesome! Question on that cars top mount - what have you done to get around running without MAF sensor? Does it throw a code but still run ok without it?
Don't the N55 have a drastically superior head compare to the N54?
yes on an MT, you can get away with more on just a piggyback, but definitely will run into issues on AT and DCT cars.
The MAF on that Top mount car is disconnected
What you looking for in a test mule? PM or email me. We may be able to help each other out.
Interested in seeing some development for E series cars
+1000 to this, the same problems pops up on every platform too.
Yup theres a reason why single guys are limiting the tq down low and why Tony killed a bunch of motors during the GC testing.
@[email protected] anyone gone to the strip with one of these?
Not yet, I can't wait though!! Unfortunately, I live in MN and will have to wait until early May before BIR has a track night... so hopefully I'll sell a few before then and someone else can get on the track before me.
Would the cast manifold fit on the N54? I nkow they have the same bolt pattern, but not sure about turbo placement and whether it would interfere on the N54 engine. Would need o2 bungs, but these might be able to be welded on depending on the alloy for the manifold. Awesome work!