Propulsive Dynamics Upgraded 6HP21 Group Buy Info/Sign-Up List

[email protected]

Corporal
Free Vendor
Nov 6, 2016
159
Madison, AL
Ok guys, I've got good news and not so good news...
The good news is that we are officially in mass production. The bad news is that due to having to completely make the G3 material and the availability of everything that comprises that material, the Production VP is telling me that the lead time is now 12-16 weeks. Lets just say I'm less than thrilled about this. I've already crawled up the Head Chemical Engineer's ass and pitched a tent so they are fully aware of my disdain of this situation. I'm not easy to deal with due to my Toyota Power-Train Engineering and Manufacturing background. This is what transparency looks like.

As of 2 seconds ago, the only person that can speed this up is the CEO/Owner of the company. He will be getting a call today...

I'll keep everyone posted but the main point is we are finally off the launch pad.
 
Last edited:
  • 2Like
Reactions: DirtKurt and 08_335i

08_335i

Sergeant
Nov 3, 2016
371
I wanted to bring this quote over to the thread just in case there was anyone wondering, but not paying attention to the Xhp thread, or just wanted to know if they could still run whatever transmission flash they preferred.




I have been watching this thread and want to clear some things up before it spins out of control with speculation...

You are absolutely right, in the beginning, due to uncertainty, we were considering any flashing of the TCU as something that would void our warranty. We have since begun to reconsider that stance with a few conditions since this will obviously remove the transmission's ability to protect itself (i.e. misfires due to pinging the torque limiters). If you choose to use xHP, it will be your responsibility to keep your power level within our transmission's calibrated power rating.

Through reading out our calibration from the TCU and comparing it to what the xHP flasher has control of, Clemens and I have been able to determine with a high level of certainty that the xHP flasher cannot access the area of the TCU that contains our custom calibration so it should not have any adverse affect on how we have calibrated the transmission.

You are right again in your statement that we have built in a factor of safety and increased spectrum of usage in where we have rated these units. Our rating of 30% increase in torque capacity over the stock configuration correlates to ~715wtq and is, in itself, a bit on the conservative side without taking into consideration the power levels we actually calibrated them at. We hardly think that $4,500 for a built and custom calibrated unit is unreasonable especially when a remanufactured stock unit is over $5,500. As I have stated in other threads, if your power goals exceed the 715wtq power level, our transmission solution is not for you.

We, too, have increased clutch plates throughout the entire transmission but not at the detriment of clutch bind which can and will effect shift quality. Any time you add clamping capacity by changing dynamic coefficients of the friction material or adding clutch plates, a custom calibration is absolutely necessary to compliment and optimize these changes. Again, to reiterate, we use 2 different machines to calibrate our units, one for the valvebody itself and one for the entire transmission as a unit (the loaded trans dyno cell). These machines cost upwards of $150k USD so very few shops have this kind of ability. This is the same calibration method BMW uses.

You are somewhat correct in stating our calibration does more that the xHP flash although what we are doing is on different sides of the fence so to speak. There is really no comparison because we are accessing and changing values in tables in 2 different areas of the TCU. In theory, xHP will enhance our calibration in the sense that you can fine tune exactly how you want it to shift and removing the torque nannies on the DME side will benefit the guys pushing the power levels to the limits of our calibration.

So, in conclusion, Propulsive Dynamics will not automatically void the warranty for using xHP but we also expect our customers to be responsible in how they treat their equipment. If you are reckless and consistently super-exceed the designed power specifications of any system, you are going to have a bad day.

Also a note of significance; we are working with [email protected] and [email protected] to develop a xHP flash that will compliment our custom calibration for those that want to push the limits of our transmissions. Hopefully this will be done before mass production of the clutches and bushings is complete so this topic of concern will be avoided altogether.

I'm happy to address any other questions and/or concerns you guys might have.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mellow Yellow

COTT3series

Private
Mar 1, 2017
48
I've been getting several emails/PMs a week regarding the Group Buy so I figured it was time to officially launch it. A few paragraphs below is a copy/paste from another thread of mine but I wanted to get a new post going to refresh the customer list.

I have also been tagged in several conversations on FB over the last few weeks. I would rather keep all of the information that comes from me limited to this forum for easy reference so I will be addressing all of your questions/concerns from this thread. I will continue to post things in this thread that I think of that I might have missed in this OP.

**Please read this FULL post before asking questions in order to keep the thread on point.**


Propulsive Dynamics, LLC is happy to announce that we are now offering a complete drop-in solution for the 6HP21/19 transmissions that are currently found in N54/N55 powered vehicles. It is preferred that the customer send in their stock unit for rebuild, however, sending a salvaged donor unit is also possible. It is of note that vehicle models 2009 and up could need a ECS module reset via NCS Expert/WinKFP to reactivate the paddle shifters after install.

We also strongly advise that the end user utilize an ATF cooler to aide in heat management of the system that uses true AN fittings. The use of AN fittings is important due the increases in ATF pump pressure and volumetric flow-rate.

The fully built transmissions offered by Propulsive Dynamics feature the following…

- Upgraded G3 Friction Material frictions

- Upgraded Kolene steels

- Increased clutch plate counts throughout

- Upgraded Race Bushings throughout

- Complete Overhaul Kit by ZF

- Fully rebuilt and upgraded valve-body

- Fully rebuilt and upgraded torque converter (stock stall, currently)

- Each finished unit is fully calibrated on a loaded transmission dyno cell

- Each unit is shipped with a calibration data packet which also includes the adaptation procedure

Propulsive Dynamics, LLC has formed an exclusive partnership with European Transmissions. They will be performing the rebuilds and dyno calibration of all of our units. They are a BMW certified transmission refurbishment facility for BMW USA.

The calibration procedure includes increasing line pressures in each clutch drum, increased flow through the ATF pump, adjustments to slip durations to compensate for the increased friction coefficient and adjustments to the adaptation parameters themselves in order for the system to learn within its new boundaries. We are rating the performance increase at ~30% over the known capacity limit of the stock configuration with increased spectrum of usage and margin of safety.

We currently have 4 beta units in the field and the owners are all reporting extremely positive results. Some of the feedback reported thus far has been…

- Faster, sportier shifts

- Firmer, more deliberate shifts

- OEM-lke shifts during daily driving

- Increased shift points (7100 RPMs reported) at WOT

Group-buy pricing will be $4,500.

Any updates will also be posted in this thread.

EDIT for Group-Buy info:

"Jason, out of curiosity, do you have any idea on how the group buy will roll out? Deposits? Delivery windows? Deposit refund policy? Etc."

Excellent question. Currently, our thinking is that after we get 10 people signed up, we would ask for 50% down to start manufacturing the clutches and bushings. Upon completion of the manufacturing phase, currently estimated to be in the 90 day domain, we would then ask for the remaining 50% and for the customer to send us their transmission for upgrade.

After we receive the customer's transmission, turnaround time is estimated to be ~4 days based on what we experienced with building the 5 previous units. The rebuild process looks like this...

- Disassembly
- Deep cleaning
- Complete inspection
- Reassemble with upgrades
- Dyno calibration
- Ship

Group-Buy List:
1) nitemare
2) 08_335i
3) doublespaces
4) braddman
5) wtfmarine
6) obed figureroa
7) BADN55
8) Charmuth.135i
9) Mellow Yellow
10) AndersS
In for updates
 

[email protected]

Corporal
Free Vendor
Nov 6, 2016
159
Madison, AL
Ok guys, I finally got in touch with the plant president. He's been in Europe for the last week or so and won't return until sometime next week but was kind enough to contact me from Europe to discuss this issue. He has agreed to help expedite the process but he cannot guarantee anything due to their tight production scheduling and the availability of raw materials.

I'll explain a bit how the mass production system works...once a production slot becomes available, it takes several days to change the production lines over to the new model. I have been to their facility twice so I can confirm how arduous and time consuming this process is. Once production begins, then comes the process stabilization phase where it is likely that a large percentage of scrap is produced until the newly changed over system stabilizes in order to run good quality with good repeatability. However, before any of this can happen, the raw materials need to be in the plant to produce the G3 friction material and this is where the majority of the lead time is and why they cannot 100% commit to a hard delivery date because they are dependent on other suppliers for these raw materials.

Anyway, that is a brief synopsis of the overall field of view. I will continue to update you guys as information becomes available to me. I can assure you I will continue to beat on them.
 

08_335i

Sergeant
Nov 3, 2016
371
I saw Jason driving around with a spiked bat in his car the other day. These guys are well aware that he means business.
 

[email protected]

Corporal
Free Vendor
Nov 6, 2016
159
Madison, AL
How many are in the group buy as of now?
12 currently as of a few minutes ago. We just had another customer sign up. There are still several spots available. I've made a new thread dedicated to announcing the launch of mass production where I will be posting updates from here on out though.
 
Last edited:

matreyia

Lieutenant
Apr 19, 2017
939
12 currently as of a few minutes ago. We just had another customer sign up. There are still several spots available. I've made a new thread dedicated to announcing the launch of mass production where I will be posting updates from here on out though.
I suppose I am number 13 then? This is Viet.

I am so looking forward to getting this installed... FINALLY.... no more slipping or errors from tuning.
 

[email protected]

Corporal
Free Vendor
Nov 6, 2016
159
Madison, AL
I suppose I am number 13 then? This is Viet.

I am so looking forward to getting this installed... FINALLY.... no more slipping or errors from tuning.
Well, you're actually #12 now...

Update:

Group-Buy List:

1) nitemare (535i) - PAID
2) 08_335i - PAID
3) doublespaces - PAID
4) Harrison Meek (535i) - PAID
5) wtfmarine - PAID
6) Blaster400 - PAID
7) Patrick Curtis - PAID
8) Charmuth.135i - PAID
9) Mellow Yellow - PAID
10) AndersS (Destination: Denmark) - PAID
11) boogashooga - PAID
12) matreyia - PAID
13)
14)
15)
 

matreyia

Lieutenant
Apr 19, 2017
939
Well, you're actually #12 now...

Update:

Group-Buy List:

1) nitemare (535i) - PAID
2) 08_335i - PAID
3) doublespaces - PAID
4) Harrison Meek (535i) - PAID
5) wtfmarine - PAID
6) Blaster400 - PAID
7) Patrick Curtis - PAID
8) Charmuth.135i - PAID
9) Mellow Yellow - PAID
10) AndersS (Destination: Denmark) - PAID
11) boogashooga - PAID
12) matreyia - PAID
13)
14)
15)
I hate it when people waste your time.
That is so disrespectful of people's time and energy.
I hope you don't get anymore undecided fake outs Jason.
 

Roman Gumenyuk

New Member
May 14, 2017
2
Is this the only time you will be able to get a upgraded transmission? Or you will have later on as well? Because this year I can't.. I spend to much already on turbos, rims, exhaust... i was thinking of next year...?
 

[email protected]

Corporal
Free Vendor
Nov 6, 2016
159
Madison, AL
Is this the only time you will be able to get a upgraded transmission? Or you will have later on as well? Because this year I can't.. I spend to much already on turbos, rims, exhaust... i was thinking of next year...?
Absolutely you will be able to purchase this upgrade whenever you're ready. We're just a few weeks away from being complete with mass production. You can read about it in the latest thread located here...

https://bmw.spoolstreet.com/threads/propulsive-dynamics-officially-launches-mass-production.1499/
 
Top